Comments on: Facebook Gifts: Pushing the limits of rationality http://fstutzman.com/2007/02/13/facebook-gifts-pushing-the-limits-of-rationality/ Thoughts about information, social networks, and privacy Fri, 06 Jan 2012 21:54:51 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2.1 By: Corinne http://fstutzman.com/2007/02/13/facebook-gifts-pushing-the-limits-of-rationality/comment-page-1/#comment-770 Corinne Sat, 23 Jun 2007 23:58:00 +0000 http://127.0.0.1/~fred/projects/blog/?p=388#comment-770 I know this is an old post, but just for the record, I actually do fondly remember gifts that I give. I remember gifts I've given my mom or dad, or anyone else not just nine months ago, but years ago, and I get a lot of pleasure out of remembering how happy it made them or how perfect it was for them. So I really think your opinion on how people feel about giving gifts might be a bit of a generalization. <br/><br/>I am a gift-giver on facebook, and at first I thought it was a silly concept, but then I got one from a friend and saw some friends give them to each other and I realized that they make me smile and that it makes me happy even just to see what my friends give to each other. I see it as an easy way to bring a little joy to the day of a person I care about, even though I am completely aware that they are fundamentally worthless, primarily because they are temporary, but also because they hold no practical use. But then again, I honestly don't see what makes a ring-tone worth any more than a graphical icon.<br/><br/>The price is high, certainly, but I think the value lies in being able to show someone you are thinking of them without spending time and effort that may be completely unavailable. They may be useless, but they certainly are cute or funny when put into context between two people of shared experience who know one another. Anyway, that isn't intended in defense of facebook gifts, but more as my theory of where the value of the gifts lies. I know this is an old post, but just for the record, I actually do fondly remember gifts that I give. I remember gifts I’ve given my mom or dad, or anyone else not just nine months ago, but years ago, and I get a lot of pleasure out of remembering how happy it made them or how perfect it was for them. So I really think your opinion on how people feel about giving gifts might be a bit of a generalization.

I am a gift-giver on facebook, and at first I thought it was a silly concept, but then I got one from a friend and saw some friends give them to each other and I realized that they make me smile and that it makes me happy even just to see what my friends give to each other. I see it as an easy way to bring a little joy to the day of a person I care about, even though I am completely aware that they are fundamentally worthless, primarily because they are temporary, but also because they hold no practical use. But then again, I honestly don’t see what makes a ring-tone worth any more than a graphical icon.

The price is high, certainly, but I think the value lies in being able to show someone you are thinking of them without spending time and effort that may be completely unavailable. They may be useless, but they certainly are cute or funny when put into context between two people of shared experience who know one another. Anyway, that isn’t intended in defense of facebook gifts, but more as my theory of where the value of the gifts lies.

]]> By: Anonymous http://fstutzman.com/2007/02/13/facebook-gifts-pushing-the-limits-of-rationality/comment-page-1/#comment-744 Anonymous Tue, 05 Jun 2007 02:12:00 +0000 http://127.0.0.1/~fred/projects/blog/?p=388#comment-744 ohhh that was February only.<br/><br/>Well i think all the money for these should go to a different charity each month, then i would definitely buy some! ohhh that was February only.

Well i think all the money for these should go to a different charity each month, then i would definitely buy some!

]]> By: Anonymous http://fstutzman.com/2007/02/13/facebook-gifts-pushing-the-limits-of-rationality/comment-page-1/#comment-743 Anonymous Tue, 05 Jun 2007 02:07:00 +0000 http://127.0.0.1/~fred/projects/blog/?p=388#comment-743 The money actually goes to charity! It isn't pure profit? The money actually goes to charity! It isn’t pure profit?

]]> By: Anonymous http://fstutzman.com/2007/02/13/facebook-gifts-pushing-the-limits-of-rationality/comment-page-1/#comment-679 Anonymous Thu, 29 Mar 2007 17:10:00 +0000 http://127.0.0.1/~fred/projects/blog/?p=388#comment-679 more than giving gifts, everybody likes to receive gifts... and that value and "feel" can be kept for quite a bit longer than that of giving one.<br/>on facebook, these bright and funky lil gifts are the only things that stand out, and kind of show your popularity, which everybody wants. having a large number of friends on facebook doesn't make you appear popular, b/c there are so many people adding randoms... however, you would only give to/receive gifts from people who you actually know well, or the opposite gender who has an interest in you. these are the ways to show your popularity on a site like facebook where the intent is to broadcast yourself to the world... we are proud of ourselves as people, we are nosy, and we are self-centered... we want to see what other ppl are up to, want other ppl to know what we're doing (brag about), and we want ppl to know how popular we are, and we always want to be the best. on facebook you can somewhat show this from the ammount of posts/postees on your wall, but you could showcase this even more with you gift collection. if you have a lot of gifts, then you have a lot of good friends and are popular, or are at least popular with the opposite sex ;) and everybody wants that, and wants to show that they are the best at it. we know these matter, because it takes extra effort to send these gifts. and of course, we go back to, but why would we bother sending them? once again, it's because we are self-centered as a people. we give the gifts, in hope that they will gift us back in return. the same way that people generally write on somebody else's wall, rather than sending them a private message, in hopes that the recipient will post back on their public wall, where everyone can see it... that said person was written to, who by, and what was said... this shows their popularity... but if somebody's willing to pay $1 to give you a gift, they must really like you... and if many ppl are willing to pay $1 to give you a gift, you must really be popular!!<br/>so we give them a gift, hoping they'll gift us in return, and striving to have the most gifts, and, therefore, be viewed as the most popular! ;) ...my theory :P<br/>p.s. i have not and will not buy a gift, since having used my free one, but i have received several gifts and love it greatly. more than giving gifts, everybody likes to receive gifts… and that value and “feel” can be kept for quite a bit longer than that of giving one.
on facebook, these bright and funky lil gifts are the only things that stand out, and kind of show your popularity, which everybody wants. having a large number of friends on facebook doesn’t make you appear popular, b/c there are so many people adding randoms… however, you would only give to/receive gifts from people who you actually know well, or the opposite gender who has an interest in you. these are the ways to show your popularity on a site like facebook where the intent is to broadcast yourself to the world… we are proud of ourselves as people, we are nosy, and we are self-centered… we want to see what other ppl are up to, want other ppl to know what we’re doing (brag about), and we want ppl to know how popular we are, and we always want to be the best. on facebook you can somewhat show this from the ammount of posts/postees on your wall, but you could showcase this even more with you gift collection. if you have a lot of gifts, then you have a lot of good friends and are popular, or are at least popular with the opposite sex ;) and everybody wants that, and wants to show that they are the best at it. we know these matter, because it takes extra effort to send these gifts. and of course, we go back to, but why would we bother sending them? once again, it’s because we are self-centered as a people. we give the gifts, in hope that they will gift us back in return. the same way that people generally write on somebody else’s wall, rather than sending them a private message, in hopes that the recipient will post back on their public wall, where everyone can see it… that said person was written to, who by, and what was said… this shows their popularity… but if somebody’s willing to pay $1 to give you a gift, they must really like you… and if many ppl are willing to pay $1 to give you a gift, you must really be popular!!
so we give them a gift, hoping they’ll gift us in return, and striving to have the most gifts, and, therefore, be viewed as the most popular! ;) …my theory :P
p.s. i have not and will not buy a gift, since having used my free one, but i have received several gifts and love it greatly.

]]> By: Anonymous http://fstutzman.com/2007/02/13/facebook-gifts-pushing-the-limits-of-rationality/comment-page-1/#comment-660 Anonymous Thu, 08 Mar 2007 23:08:00 +0000 http://127.0.0.1/~fred/projects/blog/?p=388#comment-660 my gut reaction was in line with danah's<br/><br/>don't forget that facebook is in High Schools too. Facebook is in large part about status. Gifts are a way for Facebook to capitalize on the popularity game being played out...the idea is sustainable, perhaps with modifcation to the logistics of what, how much, etc the gifts are my gut reaction was in line with danah’s

don’t forget that facebook is in High Schools too. Facebook is in large part about status. Gifts are a way for Facebook to capitalize on the popularity game being played out…the idea is sustainable, perhaps with modifcation to the logistics of what, how much, etc the gifts are

]]> By: Jessamyn http://fstutzman.com/2007/02/13/facebook-gifts-pushing-the-limits-of-rationality/comment-page-1/#comment-609 Jessamyn Thu, 15 Feb 2007 23:06:00 +0000 http://127.0.0.1/~fred/projects/blog/?p=388#comment-609 As a newsish Facebook user, I only wish I could toss my gift away. I don't like any of the shiny choices (consumating.com lets you make your own little widgets if you have enough "points" to do so) and there is no one person that I'd like to give my single free gift to, so I'd love it if they'd stop telling me to. As a newsish Facebook user, I only wish I could toss my gift away. I don’t like any of the shiny choices (consumating.com lets you make your own little widgets if you have enough “points” to do so) and there is no one person that I’d like to give my single free gift to, so I’d love it if they’d stop telling me to.

]]> By: Simon Spero http://fstutzman.com/2007/02/13/facebook-gifts-pushing-the-limits-of-rationality/comment-page-1/#comment-606 Simon Spero Wed, 14 Feb 2007 19:01:00 +0000 http://127.0.0.1/~fred/projects/blog/?p=388#comment-606 The flaw in the Facebook implementation of gifts relates to the free first gift. <br/><br/>The economic value of this kind of gift giving is as signaling behavior. <br/>Because there is no way to determine whether or not a gift that is sent was paid for or not, the signaling value is muted or lost. <br/><br/>See e.g.: <a HREF="http://gregmankiw.blogspot.com/2006/12/economics-of-gifts.html" REL="nofollow">http://gregmankiw.blogspot.com/2006/12/economics-of-gifts.html</a><br/>Simon The flaw in the Facebook implementation of gifts relates to the free first gift.

The economic value of this kind of gift giving is as signaling behavior.
Because there is no way to determine whether or not a gift that is sent was paid for or not, the signaling value is muted or lost.

See e.g.: http://gregmankiw.blogspot.com/2006/12/economics-of-gifts.html
Simon

]]> By: Fred Stutzman http://fstutzman.com/2007/02/13/facebook-gifts-pushing-the-limits-of-rationality/comment-page-1/#comment-605 Fred Stutzman Wed, 14 Feb 2007 04:15:00 +0000 http://127.0.0.1/~fred/projects/blog/?p=388#comment-605 Annie, I agree. Facebook has a lot of wiggle room here. Custom gifts, one-offs, etc. They could charge more, they could charge less. <a HREF="http://www.zephoria.org/thoughts/archives/2007/02/13/facebooks_littl.html" REL="nofollow">danah's reply is wonderful</a> and is going to allow me to flesh this out substantially...this is really a fascinating topic. Annie, I agree. Facebook has a lot of wiggle room here. Custom gifts, one-offs, etc. They could charge more, they could charge less. danah’s reply is wonderful and is going to allow me to flesh this out substantially…this is really a fascinating topic.

]]> By: Fred Stutzman http://fstutzman.com/2007/02/13/facebook-gifts-pushing-the-limits-of-rationality/comment-page-1/#comment-604 Fred Stutzman Wed, 14 Feb 2007 04:13:00 +0000 http://127.0.0.1/~fred/projects/blog/?p=388#comment-604 It's fine to say I'm wrong, but just because Hot or Not offered a feature a few years ago is quite irrelevant to this discussion. We're talking two completely separate contexts, with different meanings and pretexts. And different economic goals (scale-wise) on behalf of the implementer.<br/><br/>As the founder of Hot or Not said last Saturday, "Dating sites are like bars - someone has to pay for the drink, and it is generally the guy." This is not the model applied to FB gifts in any way. It’s fine to say I’m wrong, but just because Hot or Not offered a feature a few years ago is quite irrelevant to this discussion. We’re talking two completely separate contexts, with different meanings and pretexts. And different economic goals (scale-wise) on behalf of the implementer.

As the founder of Hot or Not said last Saturday, “Dating sites are like bars – someone has to pay for the drink, and it is generally the guy.” This is not the model applied to FB gifts in any way.

]]> By: Anonymous http://fstutzman.com/2007/02/13/facebook-gifts-pushing-the-limits-of-rationality/comment-page-1/#comment-603 Anonymous Wed, 14 Feb 2007 04:08:00 +0000 http://127.0.0.1/~fred/projects/blog/?p=388#comment-603 I think you're off here. First, HotOrNot broke ground here several years ago. More importantly, HON flowers cost $2-15. Have you considered that users might value gift giving *more* than an iTunes track? I think you’re off here. First, HotOrNot broke ground here several years ago. More importantly, HON flowers cost $2-15. Have you considered that users might value gift giving *more* than an iTunes track?

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