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	<title>Comments on: Google (reading) your health records</title>
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	<link>http://fstutzman.com/2008/02/21/google-reading-your-health-records/</link>
	<description>Thoughts about information, social networks, and privacy</description>
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		<title>By: jkd</title>
		<link>http://fstutzman.com/2008/02/21/google-reading-your-health-records/comment-page-1/#comment-1128</link>
		<dc:creator>jkd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Feb 2008 20:24:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://127.0.0.1/~fred/projects/blog/?p=561#comment-1128</guid>
		<description>&quot;As an aside, I&#039;m going to declare the &quot;I don&#039;t care, Google can see my data&quot; classist. If you get &quot;high&quot; diseases, fine, you&#039;re comfortable with people knowing your conditions. But for those who have been on the other side of our health care crisis, those people who are marginalized and get &quot;low&quot; diseases - these are undervoiced but equally important perspectives.&quot;&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;I don&#039;t think this is really fair, Fred, and you&#039;re conflating things here. Google being able to datamine my health records is not the same as their being publicly posted. And as I noted, I&#039;m perfectly well aware that my position on this is not something that most people are comfortable with, and I wouldn&#039;t suggest that anyone uncomfortable with it, utilize it. My own personal perspective is as someone who actually has a &lt;i&gt;lot&lt;/i&gt; different data in my medical records. &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;&quot;Let&#039;s think about this in the long view. Federal laws protect our health records because they are amongst our most personal disclosures. Google is offering us, with a single click of a button, the ability to essentially opt out of this protective system.&quot;&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;I&#039;m a lot more concerned about - and have I think more well-founded suspicions of bad faith on the part of - my insurance company having access to my medical history. Unfortunately I don&#039;t have a lot of choice there. But however much federal law protects the confidentiality of records, it doesn&#039;t protect me from my insurer, who in the current system is basically concerned with spending a lot of money figuring out how to deny me coverage or drop me, and keeping me as much in the dark as possible about their machinations. I have basically zero confidence that they&#039;re living up to the spirit if not the letter of the law in terms of what they&#039;re allowed to do with my information. If Google can add an element of personal data management capabilities to my health information records - can give me greater data portability and control over my own records (which I really don&#039;t feel I have, now), then I, personally, am okay with the tradeoff. It&#039;s fine to disagree, but calling that view classist is a little much.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;&quot;What I&#039;m calling for is a higher standard of ethics, one appropriate to the sanctity of the data. Google can certainly provide a repository - hell, I&#039;ll pay 150 a year for that. But don&#039;t mine it, keep it encrypted, and develop a comprehensive set of rights for the data including my right to revoke Google&#039;s ownership at any time.&quot;&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;That sounds good to me, too. We won&#039;t get there without federal legislation (which I think on this issue is perfectly possible and reasonable as a digital-information extension of the &quot;Patient&#039;s Bill of Rights.&quot;)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;As an aside, I&#8217;m going to declare the &#8220;I don&#8217;t care, Google can see my data&#8221; classist. If you get &#8220;high&#8221; diseases, fine, you&#8217;re comfortable with people knowing your conditions. But for those who have been on the other side of our health care crisis, those people who are marginalized and get &#8220;low&#8221; diseases &#8211; these are undervoiced but equally important perspectives.&#8221;</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t think this is really fair, Fred, and you&#8217;re conflating things here. Google being able to datamine my health records is not the same as their being publicly posted. And as I noted, I&#8217;m perfectly well aware that my position on this is not something that most people are comfortable with, and I wouldn&#8217;t suggest that anyone uncomfortable with it, utilize it. My own personal perspective is as someone who actually has a <i>lot</i> different data in my medical records. </p>
<p>&#8220;Let&#8217;s think about this in the long view. Federal laws protect our health records because they are amongst our most personal disclosures. Google is offering us, with a single click of a button, the ability to essentially opt out of this protective system.&#8221;</p>
<p>I&#8217;m a lot more concerned about &#8211; and have I think more well-founded suspicions of bad faith on the part of &#8211; my insurance company having access to my medical history. Unfortunately I don&#8217;t have a lot of choice there. But however much federal law protects the confidentiality of records, it doesn&#8217;t protect me from my insurer, who in the current system is basically concerned with spending a lot of money figuring out how to deny me coverage or drop me, and keeping me as much in the dark as possible about their machinations. I have basically zero confidence that they&#8217;re living up to the spirit if not the letter of the law in terms of what they&#8217;re allowed to do with my information. If Google can add an element of personal data management capabilities to my health information records &#8211; can give me greater data portability and control over my own records (which I really don&#8217;t feel I have, now), then I, personally, am okay with the tradeoff. It&#8217;s fine to disagree, but calling that view classist is a little much.</p>
<p>&#8220;What I&#8217;m calling for is a higher standard of ethics, one appropriate to the sanctity of the data. Google can certainly provide a repository &#8211; hell, I&#8217;ll pay 150 a year for that. But don&#8217;t mine it, keep it encrypted, and develop a comprehensive set of rights for the data including my right to revoke Google&#8217;s ownership at any time.&#8221;</p>
<p>That sounds good to me, too. We won&#8217;t get there without federal legislation (which I think on this issue is perfectly possible and reasonable as a digital-information extension of the &#8220;Patient&#8217;s Bill of Rights.&#8221;)</p>
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		<title>By: Ben Wright</title>
		<link>http://fstutzman.com/2008/02/21/google-reading-your-health-records/comment-page-1/#comment-1127</link>
		<dc:creator>Ben Wright</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Feb 2008 19:49:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://127.0.0.1/~fred/projects/blog/?p=561#comment-1127</guid>
		<description>Maybe contract law could help patients enhance the privacy of their health records.  &lt;a HREF=&quot;http://hack-igations.blogspot.com/2008/02/contracts-for-patient-privacy.html&quot; REL=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://hack-igations.blogspot.com/2008/02/contracts-for-patient-privacy.html&lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Maybe contract law could help patients enhance the privacy of their health records.  <a HREF="http://hack-igations.blogspot.com/2008/02/contracts-for-patient-privacy.html" REL="nofollow">http://hack-igations.blogspot.com/2008/02/contracts-for-patient-privacy.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: Bertil Hatt</title>
		<link>http://fstutzman.com/2008/02/21/google-reading-your-health-records/comment-page-1/#comment-1126</link>
		<dc:creator>Bertil Hatt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Feb 2008 12:40:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://127.0.0.1/~fred/projects/blog/?p=561#comment-1126</guid>
		<description>I like the “high” vs. “low” disease argument — and it certainly replies to my question on Bayesian ad filter on hashed conditions. I still think that Google can keep those safe, and be a great part-taker in framing a safer world by encouraging and filtering out temptations.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;No question that we need that as an option; if it is opt-in, I doubt it will have any significant success, it will justify the setting up of a anonymous filter for medical appropriateness.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I like the “high” vs. “low” disease argument — and it certainly replies to my question on Bayesian ad filter on hashed conditions. I still think that Google can keep those safe, and be a great part-taker in framing a safer world by encouraging and filtering out temptations.</p>
<p>No question that we need that as an option; if it is opt-in, I doubt it will have any significant success, it will justify the setting up of a anonymous filter for medical appropriateness.</p>
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		<title>By: Bertil Hatt</title>
		<link>http://fstutzman.com/2008/02/21/google-reading-your-health-records/comment-page-1/#comment-1125</link>
		<dc:creator>Bertil Hatt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Feb 2008 11:22:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://127.0.0.1/~fred/projects/blog/?p=561#comment-1125</guid>
		<description>“Will Google read my health records [...]?”&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Fred, I know you can do better then that antropomorphism: Google is a computer-based company, so your questions properly expressed are:&lt;br/&gt;* Will Google employees have reading access to Health files at an individual level? At almost non-identifiable level? Could Google give this access to Official epidemiology experts?&lt;br/&gt;* Will Google ad-targetting service use Health related information? Directly, or with anonymized statistical association?&lt;br/&gt;* Who will have Kill Switches &amp; Keys for that information? Will it be intuitive for the users?&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Patients need to understand the sharing principles, so this is a challenge Google seems to be the only instituion able to solve. Whether the for-profit-through-ads should control it is an issue, not fully independent, but that can easily be made distinct by a courageous President who decides to say: it&#039;s a great tool, but not even you want it in a corporation&#039;s hand, and nationalise it (or give it to whatever form of institute US citizens agree they can trust).&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;The key personal information question certainly is the one you raise: if Google keeps the control of this thing because Companies are the only thing all Americans really trust, they should not have a full access to it. I would feel OK with a blind system that cannot be human-read, but that however can say: this medical condition is associated with a great click-through for this ad; a (college of) medical expert(s) on the condition is asked (through an anonymous process if need be) if this is medically a good thing. I&#039;d love to have Tabacco addition treatment benefit from Google great Bayesian machine; I&#039;d have concern with obese people viewing nothing but junk-food ads. . .</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>“Will Google read my health records [...]?”</p>
<p>Fred, I know you can do better then that antropomorphism: Google is a computer-based company, so your questions properly expressed are:<br />* Will Google employees have reading access to Health files at an individual level? At almost non-identifiable level? Could Google give this access to Official epidemiology experts?<br />* Will Google ad-targetting service use Health related information? Directly, or with anonymized statistical association?<br />* Who will have Kill Switches &#038; Keys for that information? Will it be intuitive for the users?</p>
<p>Patients need to understand the sharing principles, so this is a challenge Google seems to be the only instituion able to solve. Whether the for-profit-through-ads should control it is an issue, not fully independent, but that can easily be made distinct by a courageous President who decides to say: it&#8217;s a great tool, but not even you want it in a corporation&#8217;s hand, and nationalise it (or give it to whatever form of institute US citizens agree they can trust).</p>
<p>The key personal information question certainly is the one you raise: if Google keeps the control of this thing because Companies are the only thing all Americans really trust, they should not have a full access to it. I would feel OK with a blind system that cannot be human-read, but that however can say: this medical condition is associated with a great click-through for this ad; a (college of) medical expert(s) on the condition is asked (through an anonymous process if need be) if this is medically a good thing. I&#8217;d love to have Tabacco addition treatment benefit from Google great Bayesian machine; I&#8217;d have concern with obese people viewing nothing but junk-food ads. . .</p>
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		<title>By: fred</title>
		<link>http://fstutzman.com/2008/02/21/google-reading-your-health-records/comment-page-1/#comment-1124</link>
		<dc:creator>fred</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Feb 2008 04:21:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://127.0.0.1/~fred/projects/blog/?p=561#comment-1124</guid>
		<description>My basic position is the idea of giving one&#039;s medical records to the market-leading targeted advertising company is absurd.  Just so we&#039;re clear on that.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Let&#039;s think about this in the long view.  Federal laws protect our health records because they are amongst our most personal disclosures.  Google is offering us, with a single click of a button, the ability to essentially opt out of this protective system.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;And what happens if I do opt out, and send my records to Google?  Can I ever take my records back?  Do my records disassociate from my psychographic profile in the system if I do that?  Hopefully we&#039;ve all got many more years, and the idea of Google possessing our health records going forward - what happens when privacy norms around health records change?  &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;I fully agree with the (impossible to disagree with) argument that the health records systems are broken.  But the answer is not this, especially when encrypted records are a fairly trivial next step.  &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;No, I&#039;m not against progress.  What I&#039;m calling for is a higher standard of ethics, one appropriate to the sanctity of the data.  Google can certainly provide a repository - hell, I&#039;ll pay 150 a year for that.  But don&#039;t mine it, keep it encrypted, and develop a comprehensive set of rights for the data including my right to revoke Google&#039;s ownership at any time.  You think Facebook has got you locked in?  &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;As an aside, I&#039;m going to declare the &quot;I don&#039;t care, Google can see my data&quot; classist.  If you get &quot;high&quot; diseases, fine, you&#039;re comfortable with people knowing your conditions.  But for those who have been on the other side of our health care crisis, those people who are marginalized and get &quot;low&quot; diseases - these are undervoiced but equally important perspectives.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My basic position is the idea of giving one&#8217;s medical records to the market-leading targeted advertising company is absurd.  Just so we&#8217;re clear on that.</p>
<p>Let&#8217;s think about this in the long view.  Federal laws protect our health records because they are amongst our most personal disclosures.  Google is offering us, with a single click of a button, the ability to essentially opt out of this protective system.</p>
<p>And what happens if I do opt out, and send my records to Google?  Can I ever take my records back?  Do my records disassociate from my psychographic profile in the system if I do that?  Hopefully we&#8217;ve all got many more years, and the idea of Google possessing our health records going forward &#8211; what happens when privacy norms around health records change?  </p>
<p>I fully agree with the (impossible to disagree with) argument that the health records systems are broken.  But the answer is not this, especially when encrypted records are a fairly trivial next step.  </p>
<p>No, I&#8217;m not against progress.  What I&#8217;m calling for is a higher standard of ethics, one appropriate to the sanctity of the data.  Google can certainly provide a repository &#8211; hell, I&#8217;ll pay 150 a year for that.  But don&#8217;t mine it, keep it encrypted, and develop a comprehensive set of rights for the data including my right to revoke Google&#8217;s ownership at any time.  You think Facebook has got you locked in?  </p>
<p>As an aside, I&#8217;m going to declare the &#8220;I don&#8217;t care, Google can see my data&#8221; classist.  If you get &#8220;high&#8221; diseases, fine, you&#8217;re comfortable with people knowing your conditions.  But for those who have been on the other side of our health care crisis, those people who are marginalized and get &#8220;low&#8221; diseases &#8211; these are undervoiced but equally important perspectives.</p>
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		<title>By: jkd</title>
		<link>http://fstutzman.com/2008/02/21/google-reading-your-health-records/comment-page-1/#comment-1123</link>
		<dc:creator>jkd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Feb 2008 03:16:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://127.0.0.1/~fred/projects/blog/?p=561#comment-1123</guid>
		<description>While I don&#039;t think this is the metric for everything - and especially for everything related to Google - to me, this is absolutely a lesser-of-evils questions. The choice here isn&#039;t between Google [maybe] looking over your shoulder at your health records and an optimal system as you describe in Germany - it&#039;s between what we have now and Google. And what we have now is.... bad. Really really bad. As in: I&#039;m not exactly sure how I&#039;d go about finding my own medical records. I guess I&#039;d ask BCBS? And would they really have my full records? Given the option, I&#039;d really rather Google do the asking for me. Actually being able to easily access my medical records would &lt;i&gt;definitely&lt;/i&gt; be worth the tradeoff in privacy. I know this isn&#039;t true broadly, but really, I don&#039;t mind.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>While I don&#8217;t think this is the metric for everything &#8211; and especially for everything related to Google &#8211; to me, this is absolutely a lesser-of-evils questions. The choice here isn&#8217;t between Google [maybe] looking over your shoulder at your health records and an optimal system as you describe in Germany &#8211; it&#8217;s between what we have now and Google. And what we have now is&#8230;. bad. Really really bad. As in: I&#8217;m not exactly sure how I&#8217;d go about finding my own medical records. I guess I&#8217;d ask BCBS? And would they really have my full records? Given the option, I&#8217;d really rather Google do the asking for me. Actually being able to easily access my medical records would <i>definitely</i> be worth the tradeoff in privacy. I know this isn&#8217;t true broadly, but really, I don&#8217;t mind.</p>
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		<title>By: Ralf Bendrath</title>
		<link>http://fstutzman.com/2008/02/21/google-reading-your-health-records/comment-page-1/#comment-1122</link>
		<dc:creator>Ralf Bendrath</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Feb 2008 02:09:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://127.0.0.1/~fred/projects/blog/?p=561#comment-1122</guid>
		<description>The German system you refer to is not yet operational, and a lot of details are still unclear. AFAIK, the data will be stored encrypted, but there will be a backup key stored with the health insurance associations. It shall be used in case someone loses their &quot;health card&quot;. Well, or or maybe for other reasons? &lt;br/&gt;Physicians and privacy advocates in Germany have therefore been protesting against the whole system for quite a while. There is always an inherent security and privacy risk if you centralize storage of data, be it emails or health records.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The German system you refer to is not yet operational, and a lot of details are still unclear. AFAIK, the data will be stored encrypted, but there will be a backup key stored with the health insurance associations. It shall be used in case someone loses their &#8220;health card&#8221;. Well, or or maybe for other reasons? <br />Physicians and privacy advocates in Germany have therefore been protesting against the whole system for quite a while. There is always an inherent security and privacy risk if you centralize storage of data, be it emails or health records.</p>
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